WT360 – The Maker Movement and Its Effect on Quality

Transcript of the show 583

Welcome to Wood Talk. Now here are three guys who like to take big pieces of wood and make them smaller. Marc, Shannon and Matt.

Alright, welcome to show number 5 83. This is kind of a, a bit of a, a different one. We’re gonna do a little q and a little q and a for you guys. Sure. Of yourself.

You ever sounded.

Thank you. Thanks very much. Welcome. I had nothing to read, so just making it up. Uh, but this is gonna be show 5 83 and oops, all questions kind of episode. So, uh, we did ask for questions on Patreon. We can only really answer a few of those on the show. And you guys left us like 16 questions there, so we wanna do our best to answer them as, as good as we can.

The reality is we may not have great answers. Because this is not preselected. We’re just reading them and making sure you guys get your, uh, your voices heard, and then maybe who knows, someone listening might have an answer for you that can, uh, you know, put you in the right direction. So we’re just gonna get through these and, uh, have some fun.

Rich Harwood is the first one I have here. He says, I’ve been woodworking as a hobbyist for about two and a half years now. It seems like the more I learn, the more I understand just how much I don’t know. I’m pretty much obsessed at this point. Tools, styles, techniques, tools. Again, it’s like drinking from a fire hose, but I’m still thirsty.

Somehow I still get a reMarcably deep sense of satisfaction touching a freshly hand, plain surface, or getting that perfect friction fit a thousandth of an inch at a time. I dutifully ignore my wife and children to get all the way through the grits. Attaboy, there you go. No skipping grits. I thought after, I thought after this long, some wait.

I thought after this long, some stuff would start. That’s a weird sentence. Some stuff, uh, would start to be a little bit more mundane, but for the vast majority it hasn’t. I assume, uh, you each had a woodworking is life period. How long did yours last? If it ever ended? Uh, when did other hobbies start working their way back into your life?

Love the show. My wife and young children eagerly await your response. The poor family. So this is actually kind of funny. As we were doing the recording for the last show, I got a couple of texts from my buddy Jason. He is someone who I know through woodworking. We met here at the shop during one of our open houses, but then we kind of became friends over nerd stuff and fitness, and he was a runner, but we started cycling together.

So now he is. Like way down the cycling path. And Shannon, he’s, he’s like you, he’s annoying. Um, he wants to go, he wants to go real fast, right? And he’s getting competitive and he’s like just trying to be the best cyclist he can. But this hobby now owns him. And I just got a text from him talking about how he is thinking about possibly selling a couple of tools or doing something to move things around in the shop to make room for his bike repair stuff.

Nice. And I think this is just kind of a natural course of things that can happen when you are kind of the serial hobbyist where you’re moving from one thing to another making room. Physically. I just sold

a Veritas plane on eBay, uh, yesterday, in fact. Yeah. Not to, not to buy a bike. I just, you know, like I said several episodes ago, I’m kind of downsizing, but Yeah.

Yeah, it’s,

it hits home. It’s, it’s common. I mean, the thing is for me, um. I definitely left that phase of it, I guess you would call it like a hobby infatuation, um, quite a while ago, I think. But, but I knew that my connection to woodworking, my love for woodworking was definitely intense enough to make a career change.

Like I want to do this all the time. And even in spite of the things that annoy me about the job part of doing woodworking, I still would rather come into the shop. And make some saw dust and do anything else. It’s still a favorite of mine, but I am definitely not in that like, ah, like we talked about it with, with the Woodcraft stories about the mm-hmm.

The early phases where you would just walk around the store and just daydream about all the cool things you could make. And, uh, these days you probably, rich probably has a couple of YouTube channels that he really likes to watch and he just, you know, maybe. A weirdo like me falls asleep watching some of those things that you’re really interested in.

Right. This is sort of a honeymoon phase. So I, I, I don’t know. As a hobby though, I imagine a lot of people get to the end of that and then maybe they’re done. They might move on to something else they might do, like Jason and think about selling off all their stuff because they bought some really expensive bikes.

You know, like, and I think that’s okay. But I’m curious, like for you guys we’re all kind of. Like we fell in love with woodworking and then we never let it go uhhuh. We just, we made some changes to make sure that we can continue to do it in an ongoing way, but it’s definitely still not the honeymoon phase.

I mean, C are any of us still in the honeymoon phase? No, I don’t think so. Right. No, no. There’s a practicality to it. There’s still a love for it, but it’s gone to a much more practical place.

Yeah.

I was trying to think about like, when did I lose my honeymoon phase? I mean, it was probably, it had to have been.

More than seven, eight years down the line. Like

when you joined Wood Talk, we all came crashing down. It’s

been a long time on this show too. But yeah, I mean, we kind of talked about it in our burn ride episode. Like each of us has a different perspective than the fact that woodworking became the job. Um, in, in one way, shape, or form.

But you’re right, like it’s the passion. Is there enough to be able to make it your job? Um, I’ve found that my love of woodworking is morphed in a number of ways simply because I moved into this kind of commercial industrial side of life. Um, and I still get really excited. Um. Talking to people, building really cool stuff.

Um, and I fortunate to get really exposed to some of the finest home builders in the country and get to help advise them on wood movement stuff and everything. What that sometimes translates to is by the time I get home to my own wood shop, I’m kind of like, ah. And I just go ride my bike. Yeah. Um, so I think some of that happened, but there’s still no question.

I will see a project now and I’ll be like, I just have to build that and I will obsess over it. And I go back to that kind of honeymoon phase where like that’s all you’re thinking about and you can’t wait to go back and start working on that project. I think it’s just become, I’ve been able to compartmentalize a little bit, which yeah.

I like to think of as being a little healthy because. You know, like, like you said, you know, neglecting everything else, including my own health, let’s be perfectly honest. Uh, really honeymoon phase. Shannon was Fat Shannon, so let’s just put it that way. There was, there was, what was it? Somebody commented on our last show that’s like, oh, we all liked Fat Shannon better.

Anyway, so yeah, I’m, I’m claiming that title, but I mean, oh boy, he’s older. Discovered I needed to get back in shape and I forgot I remembered how much one of my previous passion cycling was, you know? Mm-hmm. And I, I got back to that. So it’s a nice balance and I, I like the fact that I can put together a project, put it in clamps, and go for a bike ride while the glue dries, you know?

Yeah. It’s kind of nice.

I, I mean, for Rich, I would say it’s, it’s gonna go one of two ways. Like you’re either gonna settle in and it’s gonna happen eventually, but who cares if you’re still obsessed with it, run with it. You know, that’s the fun part. You’re gonna settle in and it sounds like if you’re going this far into it and it’s lasting this long, this sounds like it may be a lifetime hobby.

And that’s okay. Like, that’s, that’s the great part about woodworking, is you could do it for a very long time, as long as you’re physically able. Um, and that’ll settle in. The bad news is. For his family. There will likely be something else after this that won’t be woodworking. Like once it does settle down, rich sounds like the kind of guy who’s probably gonna do like I do and obsess about the next thing, whatever that may be.

He could be like me and not have that happen ever again. That’s true. No other

obsessions.

I don’t, I don’t have any, I’ve never had that obsessive phase of anything I’ve done since wood. Really? Yeah, because that’s why you’re so

boring, Matt.

I’m sorry, Marc, that I don’t fit your mold of the perfect woodworking experience.

That’s, well, that’s all the other experiences. That’s the problem.

Yeah, I was gonna say, it sounds like it is the perfect woodworking experience. This is why

he rides his mother-in-law’s bike. I know. Well,

Shannon, you gotta help prove. Not like, usually doesn’t gonna prove, ah, you’ve got nothing but a list of things to prove.

We gotta find you something you can obsess over.

Yeah, but real, like literally I’ve got a fly rod

you can borrow.

I remember. I remember being in this phase. Yeah, it was, um. I started woodworking in 2008. All your

dates were at Woodcraft. We remember. That’s what I’m talking about. This is brutal. All about it.

That was part of the whole thing. Yeah. I started woodworking in 2008 and I probably ended this phase, like 2012 or something like that, but it was like any magazine, any book, any YouTube, video, anything. I’m, I’m there. I’m watching it. I’m learning. I’m doing, I’m in the shop, I’m building things. I’m practicing.

I’m obsessing over the next project that I wanna make. Literally going through all the steps in my head before I even go out there to do anything with it. And it be, it was like a whole life consuming thing. What’s hilarious about this, uh, thing from Rich is like the, the woodworking is life, period. Like woodworking literally became my life.

It became life. Yeah. There is no other thing for me. Like you guys have your actual hobbies. I, I don’t have any hobbies that I actually obsess about. Like we talked about, like, I like snowmobiling, but I don’t obsess about it. I don’t care about like the, the stats on the snowmobiles, what the manufacturers are doing, what these different skis can do for you, your perfect shock settings.

Mm-hmm. I do not care. I just go on, go ride. I, I, I don’t care.

Yeah. I. It. It sounds like you’re a healthier person for it. Yeah, probably. Look at me. I’m

so healthy.

I think the people who do what, like I do where you’re jumping and the thing is, I don’t necessarily drop my hobbies. I add things and then I, I was gonna say, and they tone down.

Barbecue

plants spiking. It’s all still there. Yeah. They never

completely go away. I just keep adding more. It’s reflected in his

t-shirts.

Yes. Every time. Yes. Yeah. But it’s, I, I honestly think that’s a sign of a unhealthy mental state. I don’t think that’s a great place to be, like being content with the thing you’re into and continuing to do it on a day-to-day basis.

You sound more content than I am. I, I guess, I guess I’ve gone wide with

everything in like the woodworking realm. Like I’ve True, yeah, true woodworking, like furniture making. Then I did like lumber stuff. I’m like, okay, now I can do. Sawing and drying. That makes sense. And now my, now I got machinery I gotta be able to fix.

So like, it, it’s, it’s widened out. Mm-hmm. I think that has done a lot of

that. You’re younger than us. Maybe you just haven’t hit that. Like, I think that’s a natural progression. I mean, at this

point though, like, I’m the age that you guys were when I joined the show almost. Yeah. Yeah. Or Marc was at least, uh, Shannon was a little bit older, but I’m the age that Marc was when I started the show with you guys 10 years ago.

I’m just thinking about that normal progression. You know, like, you, you, uh. You, you, you get the bike, you obsess it at it, you get really fit. You focus on your power numbers, and then you kind of don’t care because you can’t hold those power numbers anymore and you stop paying attention or, and now you just like you’re fishing with a fly rod and then you started tying flies.

Then you took an etymology or entomology class to understand how the bugs do it, and now you just wanna go fishing. Yeah. So I hear like

that obsession can ruin things for you too. Like that is definitely something like you do, Shannon. Yeah, right. Of course.

I do think so. You just haven’t, you haven’t gotten far enough, like you have chair kits, but have you really dove down the chair making thing like.

Could you, could you, could you go further and maybe you just get to that point where you’ve hit saturation and

Yes. And on that, on that, now you’ve finally get a decent bite. I’ve gone down the, the rabbit hole of like manufacturing those things. Mm-hmm. That’s true on different scale than like the, like the true chair makers are.

But yeah, that’s like, again, that’s just like, just widening the whole thing. I’m not adding the variety things. Yeah. There’s some variety. So maybe that just keeps me content. ’cause I’m always learning and having to do something different. Like I just did the, all the things on Skite. I’ve never done any of that stuff before.

Yeah, but I figured it out

and I did it. You do a lot of metal working. I’m gonna say that’s a separate hobby. Just, just so you can be normal. Oh, thank you. Those

something else. Metal working. Er, just make it, whatever. Just

make it happen. Alright, so that’s 17 minutes for one question. Uh, we’re gonna be here a while, guys.

Yeah. Who wants to hit, hit the next one? That was like a dining room episode topic, I think almost, right? That

could have been a whole show. Uh, I’ll, I’ll take it. We’re under what, bill? Man? Yeah. Bill. Yeah. Uh, I know you guys are busy. So I appreciate when you produce a show. Hey, hey, here’s another one. I was gifting an eight foot slab of Live Edge cedar slash juniper, about 10 inches thick.

Damn. Um, carpenter, that’s, that’s a can’t, that’s not a slab. Um, a carpenter gave it to me for helping him go, uh, helping him with his. With his go it on. Oh, go it on his own efforts. Um, okay. He donated some tools and Got it. So assuming I can hook up a guy who owns a sawmill other than cheesy flea Marcet children’s furniture, do you see any good uses for it?

Um, it’s too big for our fireplace and not the vibe for our country cottage. So this is one of those, I have a board, what should I build with it? Questions. Those are the best. I never, I never get those questions. Um, man, I don’t know. He, he have any board though. He, like, he

could re

solid to anything. It’s even more abstract.

That’s what I was thinking, like, you know, you could make, you could make 10 boards. Yeah. Maybe start there if it’s 10 inches thick, start by making 10 boards and then go from there. You know, with, with a slab, uh, I think Matt actually did a class about this. You know, you could build whole pieces of furniture from the same slab, um, or you could build 10 pieces of furniture from it.

I, if what you’re asking is, can I do something with cedar slash juniper? Heck yeah. Yes. It’s soft. The, the Juniper variety variant is certainly gonna be. Harder, a little bit more interlocked than like your Western Red Cedar or your Atlantic white. Uh, it was probably a lot knottier. Yeah, it is.

Doesn’t have like a lot more color to it.

I don’t,

yeah, I think so. I think so. Like purples, I think. Um, is that right? So yeah. I’m trying think of something else. Well, you may be thinking aromatic. I don’t dunno what I’m thinking about. Well, I mean all of this it, I don’t even know exactly what he’s talking about. There is a line between cedar and juniper, but it could be any number of species.

But in general, you’re the wood guy. Well, but you gotta be more specific than cedar slash juniper. Um. But yeah, I mean, I, I’m, I’m of the mindset that any species can be used for just about anything. Like most of the technical properties of wood is way stronger than anything we’re ever gonna need it for.

So you’re fine. You know, don’t use an exterior wood or an interior wood for exterior. That’s the one thing I would say. This is not really an exterior wood, so I’ll say that. Whatever you do, make it inside. Make it for inside. You can make it outside if you want, just. Yeah.

Nice. I’m glad you got that question.

Um, it’s a good one for him.

All right. Next one’s from, uh, Tom Coates. As we, as we know, all of us are having problems reading today. As we know. People love when you talk about content creation. They do. I’m sure they do. After a couple of recent videos from Matt and Marc where they discussed wearing head.

Earphones in the workshop. Have you had to cut things outta video in editing that you were oblivious to when recording such as flatulence or some bad singing or even a screaming child slash wife, sorry, Shannon UPS setting off a dog. Not count as I imagine that happens quite a lot. You get a lot of deliveries there, Shannon.

No, I just have a, a blow heart of a dog.

Apparently this is happening

a lot, so I don’t know. Yeah, more than once a day leaves go by the window, like, you know, God, he’s such a dick. That’s really what it comes down to. He’s just a blow. Hod uh,

I don’t have any good examples of this. We definitely cut around, uh, screaming children in the background just because like if we’re cutting between clips of screaming versus non screaming, it’s very obvious.

So we’ll typically kind of cut around that, unless that like. A child chatter in the background is like a fun little allus to the fact that I’m a father and I live in a house with children. I pretty rarely do. I cut around like any swearing ’cause I don’t typically do that. But that happens sometimes too.

But nothing, I don’t have any good stories for this unfortunately. Trips to the emergency

room, you cut around those, right? Yeah, that was like that one.

Anything cool that happens? A camera’s not rolling. That’s like the worst part of my life.

Nice.

All the cool stuff. Camera’s off.

Um, I did have to cut out.

Um, it wasn’t audible flatulence, um, but my dog to the point where it was so bad that I, I started coughing in control of it was so bad. He replaced the air in the room. This was Alex. This was a while ago, but yeah, it was one of those, and I was just like, I can’t go on box.

Nice. That was bad. Uh, I sometimes include flatulence on purpose just as Mr.

Egg for I was gonna say, why would you cut that out? No. So I’ve got an editor and I’m sure he’s heard plenty of things, but it’s nothing I was like unaware of. I generally know when I fart, so that’s not a problem. It’s generally, no. Generally, most times I’ve reached the age where it’s no longer. I know it’s never a sure thing.

Generally, no. Um, I think mostly here. It’s car noise. We’re pretty close to the road, even though it’s kinda like a country location. There is, it’s like a main throughway that people get to a certain town here. So around traffic time, we do get a lot of car noise. He’s gotta work around that. But really not, not a ton.

Not a ton. But that

stuff though, like I’m, I know it’s going on, so I’m like working around it. Like in production, not post-production most of the time. Yeah. Like at the old house, if it was like a talking bit, we had all the airplanes flying overhead. Mm-hmm. So I had to like time all my stuff between. The, the airplane’s flying overhead.

Yeah. Here, uh, it’s gunshots is Oh, nice. Is typically what I’m like in production trying to like work around Yeah. If the neighbors are shooting and I’m like, okay. Kids are out there

practicing. Yeah.

Take a pause. Yes. Yeah. It’s actually who it is. It’s the game is How fast can I empty this clip? Yeah. Well, the game is ammo is free.

Okay. You would think that it’s like free ammo free. Yeah.

Yeah. That’s weird. Nice.

Okay.

Where do we, if I shoot straight into the air, where does the bullet come back down?

I don’t, I hope they’re not playing that game. I should.

Oh God, please.

No.

Wasn’t that, wasn’t that in grownups? That Adam Santa movie? They shoot the arrow straight up in the air.

Yeah.

Uh, alright, so we got, we did Steve’s first one on the other shot. Yeah, I did that. No, this is,

this is just for you, Marc. This is the good. Worked perfectly. Yeah. Yeah. Okay.

The age old que. So, Steve Livingston, uh, the age old question that has been beaten to death is how much protection does hard wax oil.

Finishes offer. So let’s move on, shall we? Uh, what I want to know is how does the appearance of hard wax oil compare to other more protective finishes? On each of my projects, I have done test samples of Rubio Osmo and odi. And by far I think the Odis looks the best. The holographic wood pop is amazing.

Maybe the tongue oil in odi. I also love the ease of use. Side note. I know that odis is a bad word, but this isn’t a discussion about CEOs that should not be spokesman for their company, uh, just like the product. And we don’t have as many hard wax options in Canada. After hearing Marc talk about armor seal, I would like to give it a try on projects where I need that added protection.

So my question is, how does hard wax oil finish like Otis compare in appearance compared to something like armor seal? Would there be any benefit to using tongue oil with armor seal as a top coat, or does armor seal just look as good as hard wax finishes on its own? For reference, the wood varieties I have available are Cherry Elm, butternut Douglas Fir.

And Poplar

a Canadian with butternut.

What? Oh, oh my God.

That’s the same guy actually, wasn’t it? In our it’s the same guy. Butternut guy. Better, better send somebody. Um, I, I think the answer is embrace David Marcs and just call it all tongue oil. It’s all use armor seal call. It’s all tongue oil. Find tongue oil.

You’re

fine. Um, so this is interesting. Anyone who has used both of these finishes, you immediately know the difference. It is a very big difference. Um, armor seal is a diluted varnish. It’s gonna build coats. It’s gonna be a thick film. Um, it’s noticeably sitting on top of the wood. Though it looks beautiful and I think it does it really well for, for what it is.

Especially if you don’t go too crazy with too many coats, it can look fantastic. What’s that? The tool, uh, tool chest behind you. Yeah. Armor seal. Yeah, that’s Armor Seal, right? Looks great. Hard wax oils are very low Luster finishes. There’s not a lot of sheen. There’s no major buildup on the surface, so it, it is a very light sort of coat that’s there.

If you can call it a coat, very easy to. Yeah. I mean it’s really, it’s, it’s not more of a

vest.

Yeah, that’s a good one. Like a shawl. Yeah. It’s more of like a sheer material kind of top, nice, sexy, it’s fish vest, little sexy looking. Um, but v vastly different in, in, in what these things actually are and what they look like.

Okay. So, uh, I mean, I don’t know if I fully answered that question, but I think it’s one of the reasons why people like those, uh, hard wax oil finishes. They’re easy to apply and they honestly just, they make the wood look good. They make it look good, and it’s easy to make it look good with those finishes.

They’re just not offering as much protection as you would get with something like Armor Seal, which is more of a traditional finish. It’s a traditional film. And when you touch the surface, when you put a cup on the surface or a wet glass, you’re interacting with the finish and not the wood. Whereas a hard wax oil definitely puts you closer to the wood.

The things you’re putting on it are much closer to interacting with the wood layer and not a, a layer of finish, if that makes sense. Okay. Unless you guys have anything to add, we can move on to the next one. A great question here. Thanks. Very good

answer.

Mm-hmm. I think, I think Matt should demonstrate through this next question.

Yep. Go for it.

Janice Lumber industry updates something, some blah, blah, blah. He’s show.

I think that’s all it is.

That answers the question, like there has to be more, is there not more? And maybe not. I don’t remember.

I haven’t heard it in a while.

I think it’s all the umba thinks in the beginning and make it feel longer.

Yeah.

Yeah. Although we, for the people listening, we, or watching someone asked, is that Matt singing the intro song to the,

oh, I didn’t even read the question yet. Okay. Nope. No, you never read the

question. They just think Matt had a stroke basically.

Yeah. You okay? Matt? You doing all right there? No, I’m with you guys.

I’m definitely not. Okay. Nope. Could be better. Fair. Enough’s like the worst. Oh, by the way, I have to ride my bike home and we have, we do have a tornado warning. Oh, nice. Right on. So, so this is gonna be good. Yeah, but it’s an e-bike. Your power through that motivation and, and Nicole of course worried about the appropriate things, says, try to keep Oreo in.

There’s a big storm coming.

Absolutely. Oreo’s. Bigger role on the show than you now, at least on your socials. Who is he is? Yeah. I’m sure he gets more clicks.

Okay.

Who’s reading next? This is me, I think, right? Yep. Yeah, true. Um, this is from Stephen Clement. What’s the deal with bandsaw blades? I hear everyone advise, throw away the blade that came with a saw, but that doesn’t come with an explanation of how to tell a good blade from a bad one.

My bandsaw has a vintage delta, so it didn’t come to me with a blade. I’ve been using Olson blades that are $20 each. Tho are those akin to the crap blades that come with saws, or are those good blades meant to replace the crap blades? Is there a price point that tells you, uh, the difference between a good or a bad blade?

Olson’s worked for me, but I know I’m missing out on some nirvana if it matters. I’m primarily hand to a woodworker, usually running a three eights four TPI blade cutting, eight quarter and thinner, uh, for rough ripped cuts and roughing out curves. Okay, good. ’cause that was gonna be my first thing is like, how do you use it?

Like, I mean. If, if, if all you’re doing is resaw, then you don’t really need a, you know, you never wanna use a quarter inch blade for that. So, I don’t know. I haven’t bought a bandsaw blade in 10 years. Yeah. 15 years. 15 years. So, yeah. I. Somebody else wanna answer this? Is there a price point now? I mean, I used to think there was, there are definitely, I was a wood slicer, sall, bandsaw blade guy.

So

yeah, there are definitely different classes of bandsaw blades and you get into things like the carbide tipped blades. Yeah. Ones with specialty, you know, configurations on the teeth where you can get different results or better. Results. But I also have had issues with some of those blades in the past and I’ve had them break at the weld.

Mm-hmm. And I’m like, what am, it’s like $120 mistake that was just made and I’ve gotta replace this thing. And I started to kind of come around to the other end where I’m like, you know what, that $20 blade, if it lasts me six months and I have to replace it again, I’d rather do that than have a higher end blade that keeps breaking on me.

But costs like 120, 150 bucks, maybe more. That’s

exactly what we’ve done at the lumberyard. Mm-hmm. You know? ’cause they will break. Um, yeah, and we might as well just get the cheap ones to replace.

Yeah. So I, I actually don’t think there’s anything wrong and, and I think the band saw the table saw as you’re learning when you’re getting into woodworking, when people tell you it’s great that you got that information, Hey, throw away that stock blade.

It’s crap. Get something else. Have you used it? Have you tried it? Because sometimes it’s not completely crap. Yeah, there’s gonna be better. But this is how you amass a knowledge base of understanding of how these things work over time and what you’re paying for when you pay more. Right. So I do think it’s important to actually, I.

Go ahead and use the stock blade, use it until it’s not cutting well anymore. And now you have a a reference point. You have a data point that you can use when you do buy a new blade, what the difference is between that and the other one. And you still have some life in that stock blade that you can get.

You know, unless it’s actively cutting poorly, there’s no reason not to use it. It’s a waste to just throw it away. Matt, you got other feelings on this?

I do the carbide thing and my blades don’t break, so I’m on the other end of like, oh, so this is my fault. That the only thing you should have, all right, because it, it cuts forever.

I just replaced my carbide blade on my, uh, the bandsaw on the shop last year sometime, and before that the blade I had on there was from 2018. Mm. Um, and the only reason I replace it is because it wasn’t quite cutting smoothly. It still cuts just fine. Yeah, but it wasn’t like nice and flat and like pretty or whatever.

It was rougher. That’s what happens over time. They kinda wear out in that sense. But if you’re looking for rough cuts, it’s fine. But I was doing some joinery so I’m like, okay, lemme just change it out. And before that I used the wood slicer blades and I would go through one of those two to three months.

They’d only last you that long and they were like 40 something dollars at that point. So I’m like, okay. I know I switched to the car buy blades and the first one I got 30. Four months out of Wow. For four times the cost. I think it was some or somewhere around there.

So basically ask three woodworkers, get three, three different answers.

Yep. Because I never had problems with my woodsides or blades.

Like I, I had great experience with my wood. I just use ’em and they got two dull. They stopped cutting straight.

Yeah. Well, that’ll do

it, I think for the volume you do, Matt. That’s where the, the carbide really can make its money. And I don’t know whether it was a configuration problem on my saw or a bad batch.

That I kept that, that string of breaks that I kept

having. Yeah, I don’t know what the heck was up with that ’cause I’ve like never had that problem with mine. Like my sawmill blades, I don’t have that problem. Like yeah, with mine either with, on the sawmill, I run carbide under there now and I have like a right, a blade per year on the sawmill and I can cut these big logs consistently, flatly, and perfectly, and cut through any crap that’s in them without worrying.

Okay. The blade costs more than the basic ones, but they actually last longer. And you actually can make it out of a cut if there’s metal in it. Mm-hmm.

You keep

cutting for the rest of the year. Wow. Versus a standard blade, you hit metal. You might not even make it outta that cut.

Yeah. Well, the good news is Steven is more confused than he was before he asked.

Welcome the question. You’re welcome. You’re welcome, Steven. There we go. Alright, who’s next? You up now, Matt? Uh, you are? Marc. Oh me? Yes. You. Yeah. Oh my buddy Greg. Bat. What’s happening, Greg? It’s a winge question for Marc. Um, building a bar top, that’s my favorite. Uh, building a bar top at a solid winge for a walnut bar cabinet that has a matte finish.

Uh, it’s for use in my home, not a commercial setting, so I’m not too worried about heavy duty wear and tear, and I’m comfortable making repairs if needed. I’d like the winge to appear as close to black as possible, but I also want to preserve the natural. Natural texture and feel of the wood. Nothing plasticy or overly glossy.

Boy, this is relevant to the other question that was asked. Uh, what finishing approach would you recommend to get that deep black look? While keeping the wood looking and feeling natural and still offering reasonable durability for a bar top. All right. Well of course the hard wax oils will be an opportunity here.

That’s definitely something you can consider. Um, when it comes to wge, I think pretty much any oil-based finish is gonna turn it muddy black, like I don’t think you have to work very hard to make that happen. You can use finishes that won’t do that. Like you might have trouble with a water-based finish on top of wge for various reasons.

Uh, maybe a certain type of lacquer, but oil in particular is gonna absorb. And that’s the thing, sometimes it’s bad when you see some of the, um, you now winge has the, the darkest brown and then it’s got like light brown streaks in the grain. Mm-hmm. And you wanna see that and then you go and put the, once the

chocolatey brown and it disappears.

Yeah. And it goes away real fast. So I think you’re totally fine with either a hard wax oil that’s not gonna give you a ton of protection, but you got that repairability aspect to it or other things in a case like this. I might even consider something like, um, a Danish oil, like a Waco Danish oil, one that’s basically got a little bit of oil and varnish in it.

Uh, you can get a very low luster finish. You could build as many coats as you want. With something like that, you’re wiping off the excess each time so you’re not leaving a lot of finish on the surface. So it isn’t gonna be that thick film, but it will offer a little bit. Of protection that might be helpful and water resistance and things like that.

I would definitely be looking at a, a Danish oil or something like armor seal. Again, we just talked about how different that is. That will build coats faster than something like a Danish oil, uh, which sounds like what you’re not looking for, but you can, there are things I’ve finished in the past with like one or two coats of wiped on, wiped off armor seal to try to get a little bit of protection but not go like overboard with the film thickness.

So you’ve got options there, Greg.

Well, it’s also such a porous wood that, you know, you’d have to put a lot of coats on it to get it looking super plasticy because mm-hmm. You know,

well, and you’re gonna run into the thing, thing we, well, I was gonna say, we talked about in the last show mm-hmm. Issues I’ve had with, uh, the, the finishing shop and open poured species like that, you’re running into trouble with that because now, like you said, you build that film, it’s gonna look like crap on top of that unless you do a poor fill.

Yeah. Yeah.

Okay, cool. Who next?

Last one, I think, isn’t it? Yeah. Matt, you’re up. Uh, yeah, there

we go. Um, I’m scrolling here. Oh, we did that one already. Okay. Is it Adria Adria’s question Adrian. Okay. Mm-hmm. My cheap bandsaw seems to cut all boards with a really gentle curve. They end up banana shape, like Matt Fless hand planes.

Oh, that’s a deep cut.

Is this drift or is there something else? I need to tune up. I’m just the fence to compensate for drift, but if I make a long rip cut on a long board, it ends up having a 20 foot radius curve to it. Do I either need to get a better band saw or start ripping with a frame saw? Thanks.

Oh, don’t do that. Only crazy people do that.

That’s interesting. I’m trying to like, she is a Handel school member, so yeah. There we go. Come on. Get one of these puppies video in the Handel school on how to make this. Okay. So I have, I guess I have two things I could,

I could think

of

for those That just

goes right by that.

Okay. Bye.

Yeah, just ignore it. It’s easiest. I’m sorry, Shannon. I was, you can say your thing. No. No, not, no. Don’t, don’t let him at all. Don’t

let him

go to the hand tools. Seriously. Keep going. Get a frame saw. Okay.

First thing I wanted to just kind of bring up as a possibility is how straight is the edge of the board? Do you have against the fence? ’cause if that, whatever you’re doing to achieve a straight cut on that side, if it has that same radius to it, you’re gonna be matching that radius as you’re going through along the fence.

That could be something. As, as something to think of. ’cause I have, I don’t really have a good answer for this. Um, the other only thing is it’s for some reason it’s drifting out in the middle of the cut and then drifting back towards the end. But I don’t know why that would happen either. Um, like the cut dynamics on this don’t really make a whole lot of sense to me unless it’s the board that it started with, or your technique somehow.

What about a dull blade? But it would drift in the middle. But gradually you think like that? Maybe the set’s off on one side versus the other that could maybe do it. Yeah. But I don’t see it coming back though. If the set was off, it would drift away and stay away and not come back.

What if the blade’s not running true on the wheels?

Doesn’t it doesn’t, it slightly does kink the blade and make it cut in a curve. I’ve always just been told to align it, you know, and I’ve never actually put it out of alignment to see what happens, but

I just dunno if it would come. Back into a complete curve like that. The fact that Right, right. I see what you’re saying.

It would just keep, it would take out to some certain point, so you would see like a hook shape, like a big long J shape or something, but not like a big, it comes back to where it started kind of curve. Yeah.

That is weird. I mean, my first read on it, I didn’t think it was that weird of a question. Now that you mention it, that seems odd.

Yeah.

Hmm. I mean, I think the

answer is. Uh, hurry before the tariffs kick in and go buy a really nice band. Saw from Woodcraft.

Yeah, go to Woodcraft. There’s your solution.

I hear Laguna tariffs are kicking in sometime around the middle of July. I can’t remember yet. We have all the answers.

Well, someone on there, uh, Eric mentioned, have you followed the Alex Snodgrass method?

Um, and I’ve got a video he linked to it there, uh, with Alex showing that setup method. I wonder, I mean, it’s worth like,

I don’t

do the calibration, but I’m thinking like what she’s describing doesn’t necessarily sound like something that calibration would fix.

Yeah.

Hmm. That’s a really odd problem. Hmm. I

other than to blame you and your technique, I got nothing.

It’s Adria’s fault.

I don’t like saying

that. Yeah. But I mean, per se, there’s not really a lot of technique in a band saw, right? No. You’re just pushing. I mean, you could push,

you could push hard, you could push light, you could push fast. Yeah. You know, but you’re just pushing. I mean, the only

thing with pushing that makes sense is that you’re pushing slowly in the beginning, so it’s cutting at the right speed.

Then you’re pushing too fast towards the middle, pushing too fast, and it’s, so then it’s, then it starts drift, and then you’re slowing down for some reason towards the end. So now it’s coming back to true again.

Yeah.

Like that’s the only technique thing I can think of that would make them do

this. Well, can’t hurt to calibrate like recalibrate.

See what happens. Also, can’t hurt to address whether or not maybe you need a new blade. A dull blade on a band saw will wreak havoc. It will just do things. Yeah, it’ll follow the grain. It’ll just be weird. And getting a new blade could definitely be something that will forgive a lot of those sins. You just, okay.

Go with me here. Okay, I’m ready. We’re with you Matt. Matt actually just sparked something in my head. Pushing too fast, then too slow, then too fast. It’s only on these long boards. Well, she said it curves a lot, but if it’s on a long board, address your out feed support. Um, wax your table. But then also like if, if there’s poor support.

You know, as, as she’s pushing, it’s fine. But then as it starts to like cantilever off and it’s kinking the blade, it’s deviating and deflecting. But then, you know, as it’s more and more deflected off, it re reverts back. Maybe, maybe it could be out feed support.

Yeah. Maybe try that. That’s most things like, I just like, I wanna just go to your shop and see this and like noodle it.

Well, there you go. Don’t, there’s the answer.

One first class ticket. Matt only flies first class.

I’ve not a answer for you, but at least it would be like, oh yeah, that’s. That’s, that’s weird. Yeah, we could always, that’s odd. Be like, oh yeah. Weird. That’s odd. Thanks for

the video. That was weird. Yeah. I mean, she, she could, she could just film the whole thing or that, um, you know, so I don’t know.

On a cheap bandsaw, she probably doesn’t have this option. But one thing I, that I saw Philip Morley do on my bandsaw, we were doing a lamination bent lamination video. Um, he pulled my fence. Forward, mm-hmm. Like on the in feed side, so that once it’s past the blade, he cares a lot less about what’s happening.

So sometimes if there’s some weirdness in your fence, you’re influencing the, the direction of the cut and the orientation of the cut. If the fence extends a lot further past the back of the blade. Past

the blade. Yeah.

So most of the references happening before the cut and then after the cut doesn’t really matter so much what happens as long as you have more runway to keep pressed up against the fence.

So I don’t know if the, a cheap band saw. Typically is not gonna allow you to do that, but maybe add a sacrificial or a, a supplemental fence face on there. A standoff

kind of thing?

Yeah. Yeah. So you have a little bit more room to work with of the same principle and like the s saw fence that allows you to micro steer.

Put a flat fence, but don’t extend it through the blade, put it ahead of the blade. And, and yeah, that’d be an interesting test. It’s certainly cheap enough to take a scrap block and throw it there.

I think that’s where she’s at now, is you gotta, you gotta change some things and do some more cuts, start messing with it.

Just that like the bandsaw might be one of the trickiest things to, at least for me, I find it to be one of the trickiest tools to diagnose a specific problem and fix.

I just never relied on it for precision, and I know that’s wrong because there’s been some incredible precision coming out of. Proper setup, but I was always just using it like ripping a roughs on board, like I was using it because I wouldn’t get kickback or whatever.

Mm-hmm. Or I was free handing a cut or any of the res sawing I did with a, you know, with a point fence. So I was micro steering anyway. I just never relied on it for perfectly straight cuts, you know, that was a table saw in my mind.

A lot of this stuff I don’t have to think about anymore. ’cause of the carbide blades, you don’t have to.

Even 200 saw. At least I don’t. There we go. Yeah. Like my guides aren’t touching, I’m missing a guide on my lowers. It’s like there’s no side support guide down there. Mm-hmm. I don’t really know what the drift angle is, ’cause it doesn’t matter either. So there you

go, Adria. Buy a bandsaw blade that probably costs more than your bandsaw.

I’m,

that’s the, the crappy answer. I don’t,

I mean, that’s one way to get better results. Um, I’ve done that in the past. Get a good quality immune, spend the table saw, spend more money. It’s always a good way to get good results. That is generally my solution to all. As long as you spend money at

Woodcraft.

Yeah. Oh, that’s good. Alright, well look, that was it. You guys asked great questions. Thank you for your support. Uh, that means a lot to us and if this helped you, and hopefully it did for some of you, probably not Adria,

but everybody else. Sorry. Sorry. If we didn’t please ask another question, we’re sorry.

Yeah.

We’ll do better eight next time. I guess. Ask again next time.

Ask again later. That’s what we need. We need a wood talk eight ball. Yeah,

yeah, yeah, that’d be perfect. Oh, man. Alright, well we really appreciate you guys listening, asking those questions. And of course, thanks to our sponsor, Woodcraft, for sponsoring the show.

Uh, check ’em out@woodcraft.com. All right, thanks for listening, everybody, and we’ll see you next time. I’ll, who knows? You never know.